CES – New ThinkPad Roundup
I realize that many readers of this blog are first and foremost ThinkPad T Series fans, so how could I not talk about the new T Series first? Since a lot of information has already leaked out, most of this will not be a surprise, but nonetheless, these new ThinkPads are solid offerings.
We just announced the T410s, T410, T510, and W510 notebooks. For you X series ultraportable fans, not to worry, we’ll have something for you before too long. All of these new machines feature Intel’s next generation chipset and processors. (Intel has asked me not to mention it by name until their launch later this week.)
Besides the basic spec sheet items (faster memory, next generation processors, etc.), there are multiple things that you won’t necessarily pick up about these machines unless you scour every review.
These are still black, rectangular ThinkPads that stand for traditional ThinkPad values like rock solid durability, long-term stability, and great keyboards. I consider this a good thing. As you’ll see from some of our other announcements, we’ll have offerings that are (ahem), not black with square sides if you would prefer something else.
The T410, T410s, T510, and W510 pick up many of the design attributes that were started with the T400s. These include things like:
- Optimization for Voice over IP (VoIP) with dual noise cancelling microphones, low light sensitive cameras with auto white balancing, and, my favorite, a lighted mic mute switch right on the keyboard.
- Next generation keyboard layout – keys spaced more tightly together, larger ESC and Delete keys and lighted CapsLk and Power switches. I think many of the designs feature our new rectangular spill holes as well (I have only seen early models thus far)
- Symmetrical displays – This is purely cosmetic, but we heard loud and clear that some customers want symmetrically aligned displays. These new machines fix the off-centered display of the previous T Series systems.
- Larger Touch Pad – The touch pads are larger and flush mounted so your cookie crumbs won’t get caught. The touch pads are multi-touch aware. They are better sized for the widescreen aspect ratio of the displays.
- Series 3 Docking – The T410s, T510, T410, and W510 all use the new Series 3 docking solutions introduced with the T400s.
The T510 and W510 have switched to 16:9 aspect ratio displays. Though 4:3 is not coming back, there are a lot of people (myself included) that did not want to switch aspect ratios yet again on the 14” form factor. Enough other vendors in the industry voiced this same opinion that the industry was able to convince glass manufacturers to continue making 14.1” 16:10 glass – this year at least. Thus, the T410 and T410s feature 16:10 displays just like their predecessor models. All displays are LED backlit. (Good riddance to florescent backlighting.)
The W510 has a nice display option – a 95% color gamut display plus an optional color calibrator to keep it in tune. Our photographer segment wanted a color calibrator in something smaller and more portable than the W700. Sorry, no room for a Wacom digitizer though.
The T410s now has the option of either integrated or switchable graphics. Now you can get additional performance in a small form factor that won’t burn your lap. Unlike XP, Windows 7 can switch graphics modes on the fly.
All of these machines will allow you to swap the Fn and CTRL key mapping in BIOS. Our usability team is considering making these keys the same size in future keyboard redesigns, though considering that a new keyboard layout costs a LOT of money (more than you think), these keys are still different sizes. I think this is an acceptable compromise as the power users who value this switch are likely savvy enough to remember and know the difference.
The T410 is a totally new 14” mechanical design. It adds a 4th USB port, and if you have a standard 6 cell battery, it will not stick out the back like on the T400. (The 9 cell will continue to stick out though). Speaking of batteries, the T410, T510, and W510 (not the T410s) will feature an optional bottom “bump” battery allowing up to 22 hours of battery life when used with the 9 cell battery. In trade, I’m told that your Ultrabay batteries will no longer work though on these machines. (They WILL work on the T410s though).
T410 Side Views
![4243875387_858b28f603[1]](http://lenovoblogs.com/insidethebox/files/2010/01/4243875387_858b28f6031.jpg)
Extended Life Battery
![4244635598_5791718bd4[1]](http://lenovoblogs.com/insidethebox/files/2010/01/4244635598_5791718bd41.jpg)
Underneath you’ll find that serviceability is better. Most of these machines have 1 or 2 screw access to memory and wireless cards. We know this was a big pain point for many people.
These machines do not feature USB 3.0 yet. Except for the W510, these machines do not feature USB 3.0 yet. Intel declined to provide USB 3 support in this year’s chipsets so many vendors will be skipping adding USB 3.0 on all but their highest end machines where they will be adding extra USB 3 controller chips. The W510 has that chip. We have picked eSATA on many machines, so those of you needing higher speed external storage will have options.
Speaking of USB, some of you will notice a new yellow-colored USB port on your machines. This is our new always-on USB port which will remain active when the machine is in suspend/hibernate and will allow you to charge your iPhones/Blackberries, etc. Our internal disclosures are careful to say that you need discrete graphics to get this feature on your system. Frankly, I’ve not been able to find out why this limitation is in place and whether it is a “support” statement or a physical hardware limitation statement. I suspect that the reason is that many of our integrated graphics systems ship with a 65 watt adapter (no changes to the AC adapters by the way) and most discrete systems ship with a 90 watt adapter. Perhaps our engineering team is being conservative with the amount of power a 65 watt adapter will supply and not touting this feature so as to not overload the brick.
![4243869027_9ff4ba1196[1]](http://lenovoblogs.com/insidethebox/files/2010/01/4243869027_9ff4ba11961.jpg)
Check back here tomorrow for a new post from CES.
Lenovo Meet the Modder Dean Liou
Lenovo Meet the modder- Chris Blarsky Dairy 2
Lenovo Meet the modder- Chris Blarsky Dairy 1
Lenovo H320 desktop
January 4th, 2010 9:51 am
matt – preliminary specs show that the W510 has an expresscard/34 slot rather than 54. if the W510 is built for photographers, why was the smaller, less useful expresscard slot chosen? the majority of pro photographers use compactflash cards, making the 54mm slot perfect for a flush-fitting expresscard adapter.
are the specs incorrect? is there a compactflash card slot built in that someone missed?
January 4th, 2010 10:33 am
Hi Matt.
I am reading on Engadget that T510 and W510 are using the ultrabay enhanced rather than ultrabay slim drives, is that true?
So the new laptop would be using media slice batteries like on the X60/X61 laptops… nice…
January 4th, 2010 11:10 am
Matt – None of the spec sheets indicate whether either the T410, T510, or W510 will support SATA 6 for the primary hard drive. Micron and Intel will soon be shipping SSDs that support read rates that outpace even SATA 3. Shall we assume that this release of machines are all limited to SATA 3?
January 4th, 2010 11:15 am
What about the discrete graphics in the t510? How much of an upgrade are we getting coming from a t500?
January 4th, 2010 11:16 am
Erik — 34 mm only, for space reasons. I hear you on the high speed CF reader needing a 54 slot. You’ll need to get one of the 34 readers which don’t support flush mounting.
Jared M – I’m pretty sure it is SATA 300 and if I find out differently, I’ll post a correction here.. Maybe next year for SATA 600…
lead_org – I think that all have switched over to the 12.7mm drive, but I think we have removed bay battery support from all systems except the T410s. The X series slice battery is NOT compatible though.
January 4th, 2010 11:31 am
Hi Mat!
Have you tried the new T510 keyboard is it stiff?
Thanks & Congrats
January 4th, 2010 11:32 am
What will be the highest available display resolution for 14″ and 15″ models ?
Does any of these models will have display with real contrast ratio (measured by 3rd party reviewers like http://www.notebookcheck.net ) better than 150:1 ? (Sony and Apple currently provides 500:1 or more, similar to older ThinkPads like discontinued R61 15″ WSXGA+).
Is the Gobi WWAN card option available for all T models without locking to specific mobile provider ? It is important for countries where GPRS/EDGE is the only available standard technology without any plans for wide coverage by standard 3G network. Thanks.
January 4th, 2010 11:34 am
Are you able to say when the X-series announcement will be ? This month ? Next month ? Further out ?
January 4th, 2010 11:37 am
Like puppy, I would like to hear more about the new displays also.
January 4th, 2010 11:46 am
hi,
i’m quite interesting in learning why won’t the new bottom battery work on the t400s/t410s? presumably it’s just connected via the docking (i’m guess, judging from the photo) or am i completely mistaken? i would love to have that plus the bay battery and the original one on my t400s
and why remove bay battery support? wouldn’t it be even better to have 22 hours PLUS the bay battery? that would kick everyone’s ass
cassio
January 4th, 2010 11:53 am
amardeep : that would presumably be the x100e http://www.engadget.com/2010/0.....her-think/
i’m surprised the edge isn’t called x3something, but i guess that’s because you guys (understandably) don’t want to put it at the same level with the x300/301.
January 4th, 2010 11:58 am
The always powered-on ISB is a killer feature for me
January 4th, 2010 12:29 pm
So far, this leaked roadmap has proven to be true:
http://www.engadget.com/2009/0.....uary-2010/
(you can also find the name of the new Intel chipset there)
We should see X210(s, t) soon, as well as SL420, SL520.
January 4th, 2010 12:32 pm
Wasnt always on usb in the last gen thinkpad?
January 4th, 2010 12:37 pm
Ditto on wanting to hear more about the color, quality and viewing angles of the displays. I know that IPS isn’t coming back, but I also know there are non-IPS screens out there that perform decently, and that Thinkpads don’t have them (yet).
January 4th, 2010 12:43 pm
@Joe At least my X300 has a BIOS option to always turn on USB power, it only will work when AC is connected, though.
Matt, does the new always-on USB port also work with a powered down system on battery?
Also, I’m wondering if the X30x series will be discontinued… Hopefully not!
January 4th, 2010 12:55 pm
Yes it was always one when you set this option in BIOS. It only worked when you had laptop connected to power adapter …
January 4th, 2010 12:56 pm
on* sorry
January 4th, 2010 1:07 pm
The last gen ThinkPads (at least the x200) do have a BIOS option for providing power to USB (I believe all of them) even when in S3 sleep, hibernate, or off (provided AC power is connected). I have charged my phone (LG enV3) and GPS (Garmin 765T) with this many times.
However, my iPod (old 40GB photo) is actually DRAINED rather than charged if I try this (the ThinkPad needs to be on for the iPod to charge). Presumably, this is because the voltage provided to normal USB ports when off is not as high as it should be. I would think that the “Powered” USB fixes this problem and may even be able to provide additional power (normal USB is capped at 5v and 500mA == 2.5w).
Overall, the new T-series look pretty well designed. The T410 is loaded with A LOT of ports (far more than the T400). The slice battery is interesting, although I’m confused as to why bay battery support was removed (there may be an EE reason why three batteries is difficult, but I’m not sure). I’m also curious as to how powerful of a GPU could be fit into the T410s due to the slim form factor (is it the same as the the 410?).
January 4th, 2010 1:10 pm
Charles & jonlumpkin : I have 2 thinkpads ( R60 & T61 ) and i did not know about the bios option … thanks , I will check that
January 4th, 2010 1:21 pm
As for discussion about USB ports. Is there any effective current-overload or short-circuit protection ? Damaging single USB port means to replace the whole motherboard.
January 4th, 2010 1:50 pm
would glossy panels be ever available as an option in the T series (been waiting for that for years)? Is the “nicer” panel from W510 be also available on T510?
January 4th, 2010 2:40 pm
Will T410 be more powerfull than “old” T500 ? In performance, gaming … Im talking about CPU and GPU intensive tasks…
January 4th, 2010 2:43 pm
16:9 displays on the HIGH end W510? Part of me just died inside. On a laptop like this where cost is secondary to productivity, WTH were you guys thinking? Best start up your own LCD manufacturing again like the good old days of IDTech. You’re losing customers mighty fast.
January 4th, 2010 2:56 pm
[...] As I was writing this post, Lenovo’s Matt Kohut put up an excellent summary of all these refreshed models, highlighting the major changes, including a few that I’d have missed. I highly suggest you give it a read. [...]
January 4th, 2010 3:06 pm
I’m glad I’m not the only one who still complaints about extermly poor display quality. Here http://lenovoblogs.com/insidethebox/?p=220 has been stated: “For readers of this blog, yes, I had our team run the math. In order to provide a high end IPS display option, we’d need well over 15,000 confirmed orders to make it even worth considering.” I’m not a marketing expert but if two machines were sold only I don’t think it would affect Lenovo profit.
January 4th, 2010 3:08 pm
If what they are saying is true, then other companies like apple and sony will be forced to switch also… So there will be no where to switch to… If that is not the case though…
January 4th, 2010 3:09 pm
[...] offenbar scheinen Lenovo aus ihren Fehlern zu lernen Inside the Box Blog Archive CES – New ThinkPad Roundup Dann werde ich wohl noch etwas warten, gleichzeitig warte ich noch bis neue MacBook Pros kommen [...]
January 4th, 2010 3:31 pm
Puppy :
lenovo (or any manufacturer, for that matter), buys things i bulk. what are they going to do with the remaining 14998 lcd panels if they only sold two?
January 4th, 2010 3:40 pm
Cassio:
Ebay?
January 4th, 2010 5:39 pm
Joe – nVIDIA NVS 3100M 256MB or 512MB. W510 has QuadroFX 880M 1GB, T410s nVIDIA NVS3100M 512MB switchable.
Khalifa – I have not tried a shipping level 510 keyboard yet. I’ve only seen pre-production models, so I can’t be sure that something didn’t change by the time we ship. It SHOULD be similar to the 400s though (emphasis on should).
T510 will have HD, HD+, FHD display resolutions.
T410 will be WXGA or WXGA+
Puppy – We’re using Gobi for alll of our WWAN cards worldwide except for China.
Multiple – We removed the battery connector from the Ultrabay for cost reasons.
Charles — more powerful, yes, though I would recommend checking out the various benchmark sites to get their take as it will vary based on how you spec the system. Modes like Turbo Boost will significantly help certain apps.
January 4th, 2010 6:24 pm
So my big question, having a recent T400s – will I get an upgrade for my BIOS to Ctrl-Fn? How on earth can you fit discrete (switchable?) graphics into that package?!?
January 4th, 2010 6:24 pm
Will blu-ray burner be back as an option? Seems to have disappeared for many, many months… wondering if/when it comes back??
January 4th, 2010 6:27 pm
matt – T410s/T410/T510/W510 will all have switchable graphics option or only T410s?
January 4th, 2010 7:02 pm
About the plans of changing the keyboard layout on future models such that Fn and Ctrl keys are the same size:
I strongly advise against this. This would make the (regular) Ctrl key even smaller. Keep in mind that it’s just a fraction of users that can’t get used to the thinkpad layout. Changing the Ctrl keys’ size would affect _everyone_. In my opinion, the BIOS switch option is enough.
January 4th, 2010 7:14 pm
I hope the new models support SATA 6Gbps… a lot of SSDs are pushing the limits of SATA 3 Gbps already. It would be a shame for the new Thinkpads, given the speedy new chipsets and platform, not to be future-proof and ready to take advantage of the blazing SSDs that will be arriving in the next few months.
January 4th, 2010 7:31 pm
@Matt, i read that W510 and T510 would no longer use magnesium rollcage and instead it has a Polycarbonate external case (presumably the Carbon Fibre Reinforced polymer base of the T and W series will also be dropped)… and cost is quoted as a factor.
Will the new Thinkpad can still withstand people standing on it? or DOW truck driving over it as in the case of T400s (presumably T410s will retain the chassis materials of the previous generation)…..
January 4th, 2010 8:16 pm
Ghost — only T410s will have switchable. The rest will be discrete only or integrated only.
Felix — it isn’t a plan, it is something they are thinking about. Your feedback is good and I will make sure our usability team gets it.
Lead_org – T410s still is the same construction as the previous generation T. The T410 & T510 still use a bottom Mg Roll Cage, but their tops have changed. I would still stand on any one of them or run over them with a truck.
Dan – For right now at least, Blu-Ray is out, but that doesn’t mean it cannot come back.
Anon – The T400s chassis was designed with support for discrete graphics all along. Since the T410s is the same chassis, voila.
January 4th, 2010 8:27 pm
@Matt so the top of the T510, T410 and W510 would be using Polycarbonate or CFRP/GFRP as a construction material for the top case? or would it be in similar format as the Thinkpad R500 bar the PC top case……
January 4th, 2010 8:32 pm
# amardeep Says:
January 4th, 2010 at 11:34 am
“Are you able to say when the X-series announcement will be ? This month ? Next month ? Further out ?”
I’m with ama4rdeep. Very curious about when the x201 (or x210? or x201s?) will be announced and available. Any info/guess re this, and re what improvements it will have?
January 4th, 2010 8:49 pm
“These machines do not feature USB 3.0 yet. Intel declined to provide USB 3 support in this year’s chipsets so many vendors will be skipping adding USB 3.0 on all but their highest end machines where they will be adding extra USB 3 controller chips.”
This was one thing I was particularly keen to learn about: Will Lenovo adhere to IBM’s well-known policy to pioneer new technology standards? Indeed, it seems like you still live up to that one, although I’m very disappointed that there’s no USB 3 or Light Peak in the new models, of course. Well, I guess Intel is to blame and I bet there lies a marketing reason behind that strategy.
January 4th, 2010 9:04 pm
We’re all saddened by 16:9. OTOH, everything else looks promising.
(Please don’t change the size of Fn/Ctrl keys.)
January 4th, 2010 9:09 pm
Could you elaborate on the changes to the keyboard and what is meant by “keys spaced more tightly together.” Are the individual keys smaller? Are the F-key groups still space separated?
I *love* the current keyboard layout – I hope it doesn’t change too much!
January 4th, 2010 9:27 pm
I’m curious about this new GPU (nVIDIA NVS3100M), given that no one seems to know what it is…
January 4th, 2010 9:31 pm
@Matt, i read that the W510 comes with 4 ram slots, is that true?
January 4th, 2010 9:42 pm
Matt – I realize you don’t have a crystal ball. Would like to buy a T410/T510 next week and was hoping blu-ray burner would be back. Assume no other TP options. But if BD comes back in the future, is it more likely to come back for one or the other? Just thinking that I would like to buy laptop this week but if I get a shot to buy a burner later, would like to make sure I have model most likely to take it as a later accessory. If that makes sense…
January 4th, 2010 11:29 pm
From a few first looks I’m pleased that for the T410 you’ve managed to keep 16:10 panels and I also like the amount of ports you’ve got without disrupting the battery and with adding quick access to the internals.
DisplayPort and the horizontally mounted USB slots are cool. I don’t see why only one of the USB ports is always-on, is that the same with the BIOS switch in the T400, it’s a good feature though and the visual distinctiveness is great. All displays are LED backlit? Finally.
It’d be interesting to know about the switch back to Nvidia, I’d taken to preferring ATI especially now that they’ve taken a better stance with regards to Linux.
Overall I’m quite pleased with the new announcements. There’s a bag of great features there.
Still waiting on that T300.
January 5th, 2010 1:10 am
- I need/want/must have a T410 fully loaded… Website shows for sale on Jan 7th, when will the T410 actually start shipping?
- I want a super high-resolution screen… WXGA+ on a 14″ = weak.. Can you find us better display?
- Don’t mess with the Fn and CTRL key .. I’ve been on a ThinkPad for 10 years and love the keyboard. (I like my wife’s X200 better than my T61 because of the more solid feel.)
- I was hoping for switchable graphics like on the T400. When I’m traveling I need all the juice I can get, but when I’m plugged in and using a DisplayLink for a 3rd monitor I need serious juice.
- Can the T410 drive a 30″ 2560×1600 display?
January 5th, 2010 1:38 am
Will the t410 use Arrandale processors? If so, it seems odd that switchable graphics would not be an option.
January 5th, 2010 6:15 am
Some nice steps forward with this new models Matt. Any indication yet when these will be available in New Zealand and Australia?
January 5th, 2010 6:45 am
Will the display port also output digital audio so it can be converted to HDMI?
January 5th, 2010 9:18 am
The renewed T410s with 16:10 aspect ratio looks again very promising to me.
Matt related to USB 3.0, I wonder that some sources tell that at least the W510 will have an USB-3.0 controller and thus is actually (today) the only notebook which supports USB 3.0. See for example this german source here…
http://www.heise.de/newsticker.....95354.html
…well this is somehow contrary to what you told us above, so who is right here?
January 5th, 2010 9:45 am
vkyr – I goofed. Yes, the W510 does have 2 USB 3.0 ports. At your prodding, I went back and checked with the disclosure and I don’t know how I could have missed something so significant. Apologies, and thank you. I have fixed the text above.
January 5th, 2010 9:49 am
Matt: I donť understand why in T410s there´s no possibility to use additional bottom battery as it is by T410 and T510. You also can´t use 9cell primary battery because of the position of the battery at the front side od the notebook body in T410s. It´s a pity because people won´t get high battery life if they buy the flagship of lenovo – T410s.
January 5th, 2010 10:04 am
lead_org – I am not quite sure what the material is in the top of the case. None of the resources I have here says for sure. I hope to see the product manager here in the next day or two and will make it a point to ask him.
YES on the 4 RAM slots
Steve — If a product is unannounced, I am unable to talk about it.
Abtin — check out these links:
http://lenovoblogs.com/designmatters/?p=1863
http://lenovoblogs.com/designmatters/?p=1565
quasi13 – enabling switchable graphics requires some additional logic in order to make it happen. Plus, the systems mix and match the use of 3, 5, and 7 series. The 7 series doesn’t have integrated graphics and adding that variable to the mix did not make sense to those who make these decisions.
If Blu-Ray comes back as an option, it is likely to appear on the T510 or W510 first. I have no idea of when/if it might appear, so you may want to consider buying it from one of our business partners from their current stock. I do not want to alarm, but I do not want to set expectations either.
Paul — I’d love to hand deliver one of them to ANZ for you as you live in a beautiful part of the world. We have global avaiability scheduled for February, but it is always up to the individual countries as to when they introduce the products based on how they want to manage selling through their old stock.
Jon – The swtich of graphics vendors was based on multiple factors including technology roadmaps, parts availability, cost, and driver support.
January 5th, 2010 10:14 am
Matt – Any update on whether either the T510 or W510 supports SATA 6? Again, Micron is shipping their consumer market SATA 6 drive in Q1 and Intel will follow sometime this year.
January 5th, 2010 10:23 am
Is the x100e equipped with ThinkLight ?
January 5th, 2010 12:27 pm
Matt thanks for the update waiting for my T510 now
January 5th, 2010 2:58 pm
Hey Matt. You gave me the graphics card model for the t510, but you didn’t say if it would be much of an upgrade from the t500? That was my question.
Thanks!
January 5th, 2010 3:46 pm
It’s sad that T510 will have only low-end discrete graphics (unlike T500).
January 5th, 2010 4:09 pm
Are you saying the t510 is a graphics card performance downgrade?
January 5th, 2010 4:37 pm
Hi Matt, I really hope you’ll answer this question for me:
I realize that most of the hardware updates on the new t410 t510 are derived from those of the t400s. What is the possibility of the screen thickness of the t400s/t410s being eventually be used of future thinkpad models and would it be too costly to implement?
January 5th, 2010 4:44 pm
On the T510, is there any way to differentiate between plugged in/battery/low battery without looking at the screen or the outside of the lid?
January 5th, 2010 4:50 pm
[61] NVS3100M is slightly modified lowend geforce for 2D and business graphics. ATI FireGL V5700 (in T500) was mid-range radeon certified for 3D/CAD apps.
January 5th, 2010 4:53 pm
I bought my t500, first thinkpad ever, because of the decent graphics card and good build. (ati3650 is the card used), I think the w500 has the FireGL you mentioned.
January 5th, 2010 4:59 pm
Sorry, my fault. But Radeon 3650 and V5700 are the same GPUs with the same performance (except in special 3D apps). Maybe NVS3100M won’t be a performance downgrade, but it definitely won’t be an upgrade.
January 5th, 2010 5:10 pm
Moving from ATI to nVidia is another bad move giving its poor power control features.
January 5th, 2010 5:14 pm
High power usage? You can always switch to your other… wait…. nm, its a t510.. :\
January 6th, 2010 2:25 am
Matt, several rumors on RollCage. Is there still RollCage behind the screen? On all models?
Thx
January 6th, 2010 7:41 am
Where is the display connector? In hinges?
January 6th, 2010 2:40 pm
Jared M – I still think the answer is no on SATA 600.
Swarm — Choose the W510 for better graphics. It is the same form factor and mostly the same systemboard as the T510 only with higher end OpenGL graphics.
Kevin – Possible, though it would probably require a different case for the T410 at least. The T400s/T410s uses a shaved glass/ultrathin display protected by the next generation Roll Cage.
Nick — I think it is a micro coax cable routed through the hinges, though I haven’t had one apart to take a look.
Honzyk – T510 / W510 has the next Generation Hybrid glass fiber/carbon fiber Roll Cage just like the T410s/T400s/X200s. In the bottom is our Roll Cage to protect the rest of the system. The T410 is a PC-ABS plastic top with the bottom Roll Cage inside.
January 6th, 2010 3:08 pm
I am just hopeing the price difference between the base t510 and the base w510 is a similar amount to upgrading to a dedicated graphics card on a t500.. If its much more, the Thinkpad will lose some of its cost/performance ratio for graphics heavy applications..
January 6th, 2010 3:09 pm
Does the new gen carry sound over hdmi now?
January 6th, 2010 3:39 pm
How will the slice battery be used? Does it have to drain all the way first before the internal battery starts draining? I always thought this a poor implementation of extended batteries. Seems they should draw power from both equally to minimize wear, or switch back and forth periodically.
January 6th, 2010 3:41 pm
[72] I guess that T510 has the same system board as T410… probably with directly soldered GPU.
January 6th, 2010 4:18 pm
If that is the case swarm, then why doesn’t the t510 have switchable graphics when the t410 does?
January 6th, 2010 4:19 pm
Matt, So if i am understanding this correctly The T400/500 had the option for switchable graphics, but that feature is now removed from the T410/510? What is the reasoning for this? Why add it to the t410s and remove it from the other two models?
Sigh… I was hoping to buy a T or W510 with switchable graphics but now I guess I will stretch my T60 a while longer and maybe wait for the next round of updates and hope for switchable graphics to return across the board. I could be tempted to go for the t410s but the price is a lot more expensive. I can get a much bigger and more powerful W series machine for less!
January 6th, 2010 5:07 pm
I am guessing it all comes back to the new screen size/new chassis for the 15 products. The 410 didnt change to super wide, so it kept switchable graphics, while the others were redone to HD proportions and a new chassis, and it was decided for this redesign, the extra space required for switchable graphics was not worth the trade off.
January 6th, 2010 7:02 pm
@Matt I see that in W510 specs there is RGP-ph display. Could you tell us more about the high-end display on W510 and also provide some pics if possible?
January 6th, 2010 7:51 pm
@Matt Kohut
Has Lenovo moved the T410, W510, T510 to the the PC/ABS for the bottom case, like it is on the R500? As opposed to the CFRP on the T400/R400/T500/W500?
January 6th, 2010 7:53 pm
Also the T410 will still have the traditional mg screen rollcage?? or it is just a plain ABS/PC plastic top with no mg rollcage support like the R500?
January 6th, 2010 8:12 pm
T410 doesn’t have a top rollcage what a disappointment !!! me no buy!
January 6th, 2010 10:59 pm
I would be interested in the audio-over-diplayport detail as well.
Is the W510 one of the “future versions” of Lenovo’s systems, Matt mentions here:
http://forums.lenovo.com/t5/W-.....575/page/5
?!
That would be great!
January 7th, 2010 3:36 am
Will the DisplayPort on the T510 support HDMI (video/audio) passthrough so that I can use an DisplayPort->HDMl cable to connect the laptop to my TV?
January 7th, 2010 5:58 am
T410 without a rollcage (top)??? A more appropriate name would be R410e.
January 7th, 2010 7:41 am
What kind of battery life could I expect on a T410s, LED, SSD, 6 cell?
I don’t see any models with discrete graphics on the US site? When will they be on the AU site? Looking forward to what is finally a worthy upgrade to my ageing Z61t.
January 7th, 2010 10:14 am
So I’m looking at the T410s today, and I don’t see any mention of switchable (or even discrete) graphics. It just has “Intel Graphics Media Accelerator HD, Intel Core i5-520M Processor”. When will this be available?
January 7th, 2010 1:53 pm
I’m very confused about the Elite T410/T510 with discrete graphics. If it’s got the Arrandale chipset (with integrated graphics on-die) AND an NVIDIA NVS 3100m, which wouldn’t there be a facility for using integrated graphics on battery power and the NVS 3100m when plugged in?
January 7th, 2010 2:00 pm
I woke up this morning ready to buy a W510. But wait… No Nvidia Quadro FX 880M, and no 160 or 256 GB SSD. Are these coming later? Is the NVS 5100M a re-badged NVS510M?
Any information is greatly appreciated. Thanks.
January 7th, 2010 2:33 pm
I just ordered my T410s and am very excited but it’s a bummer that it may take up to 4 weeks to deliver. I wish Lenovo would get a launch pre-set so they can start making the machines the day they launch them. Why is this not done?
Additionally, still trying to figure out the slice battery thing. My customer service rep said it would be available in a few weeks on my machine, but it seems above that it is not….what is the right answer? If it is not, why wouldn’t you make it available, or is one upcoming? I can’t believe you wouldn’t offer this for such an expensive model….makes not sense.
I’m especiallly excited about the multi-touch screen I ordered. I was also looking at all in one desktops and noticed that the multi-touch screen is not available and found this odd…..why not?
Finally, it would be great if all multi-touch screens could at least move like a tablet screen does………..it just makes sense!
January 7th, 2010 5:59 pm
I just returned a W700 because it came with size 34 express card and compact flash. I have never had 34 on a computer, and there is no 34 card that supports double SATA.
I can do without compact flash, it comes with the cameras and plugs in nicely. I would have preferred the option of a 54 and a 34 card to add maximize the functionality of the computer. I don’t need a computer that takes over an easy function of cameras, that can plug into the computer. I don’t get it. Are you sacrificing making great computers that are highly functional, to satisfy a few people who don’t want to plug their compact flash into their computer?
I just returned a W700 because it did not come with a 54 express card. I really want the 510, but it would be the first time in my life that I did not have a 54 express card. You must have some lazy designers who don’t like to use the compact flash on their cameras, and don’t care about much else.
The 510 looks like a great computer, but you made one big design flaw here.
January 7th, 2010 8:11 pm
Does the W510 have a DisplayPort like the T510?
January 7th, 2010 8:28 pm
Apparently, the W510 will have teh Quadro FX 880M as mentioned here: http://www.nvidia.com/object/p....._m_us.html So I guess the 5100M is a rebadged 880M.
January 7th, 2010 8:43 pm
I saw the Nvidia website and the only reason I don’t think the NVS 5100M is a rebadged Quadro FX 880M is that the Quadros seem to be a line oriented more toward professional graphics users–while the NVS series are advertised as serving business needs that are far less graphics intensive. I could be wrong and would love to hear from anyone who knows what’s going on. John Hobbes wrote (at this link: http://www.thinkpads.com/2010/.....s-on-sale/ ) that it’s possible the 5100M was just a typo and is actually the NVS 510M.
Curious.
January 7th, 2010 8:46 pm
Why 4 DIMM slots on the W510? I would assume that you would be running triple channel memory, like all the other core i7 systems?
Also, are there any performance specs or information on the “NVS 5100m” adapter? there seems to be no info on this anywhere.
January 7th, 2010 11:32 pm
I was looking for information about what external video support the T410 has. My goal is to drive two 24″ monitors (1920 x 1200) and the laptop’s own display at 1440 x 900 (no mirroring). Can I do that? Do I need a port replicator / dock? If so, which one?
Thanks!
January 8th, 2010 3:52 am
Matt,
Are they selling the T410s WITH the Nvidia NVS 3100 M switchable graphics configuration yet on the US Lenovo website? I can only see the Integrated graphics configuration of the T410s so far. If not, when will the Nvidia configuration be available? Thank you sir.
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January 8th, 2010 3:59 am
Matt,
When will the T410s with the switchable Nvidia graphics option be available for sale on the US Lenovo website? I can only see the integrated graphics configuration on the website at the moment.
Thank you sir.
January 8th, 2010 4:55 am
Jamie Gruener: Even the new generation of ThinkPads (and other laptops) doesn’t support more than two active displays. You need a USB-DVI adaptor.
January 8th, 2010 10:47 am
Are you able to say when the X series update will occur?
January 8th, 2010 12:28 pm
Matt,
Can you please tell me when the Lenovo website will start selling the T410s with the switchable graphics configuration? The only configuration I currently see for the T410s is integrated graphics.
Thank you sir.
January 8th, 2010 1:55 pm
Matt, can you please confirm only the T410s has switchtable graphics? The lenovo.com website lists the T410 as “Better CPU, nVIDIA® switchable graphics, ” and the T410s as “plus faster processors and nVIDIA® switchable graphics. “
Are you sure it’s just the T510 that lacks switchable graphics?
January 8th, 2010 4:17 pm
Matt, I looked for the Thinkpad T410s w/ switchable graphics on the Lenovo website, but I couldn’t found the option. I ask the sales support team about this, but he is as clueless & just asked me to keep on checking the website. Any idea when that will come out for sale? Can’t wait anymore!!!
January 8th, 2010 5:07 pm
I don’t understand why Lenovo is so bad at communicating the simplest things.
According to:
http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILib.....s#tabstart
The T410, T510, T410s are all “Integrated Intel® 5 nVIDIA® switchable NVS3100M 512MB”
* Which models have switchable graphics? *
I won’t even ask why you’ve downgraded the graphics on the T510 compared to the previous generation, or why you’ve taken out graphics switching to save a few dollars on a high end business notebook which will now have 1) worse battery life than the previous generation and 2) worse graphics performance.
No one is going to care about the keyboard if you keep screwing up the fundamentals this badly. If Dell or HP announce switchable graphics and it’s true that the T510 doesn’t have this, I’m switching over this year without a second thought.
January 8th, 2010 5:42 pm
also note, that on nvidia’s page, it features a W510 on their quadro (not nvs) product page:
http://www.nvidia.com/object/p....._m_us.html
On lenovo’s site it’s a 5100m. And no description of whether it’s switchable as it was in the W500.
What a mess.
January 8th, 2010 8:38 pm
Mike — No matter how we implement battery charging/draining, someone isn’t happy. Some want the slice to drain first. Others want the main battery to drain first. Still others want equal.
Leon — I don’t have many specs yet about the 95% Adobe RGB color gamut display.
For those who can’t find specific things to order, just remember, announce does not necessarily mean available for ordering and it certainly does not imply “shipping that day.” Give it some time for the other spec configuration choices to become available.
W510 and T510 both have a DisplayPort.
Jamie — only two displays of any time can be active at a time. This is a chipset limitation among other things. If you want to drive the primary laptop display plus two external displays, you’ll need to have a USB/DVI dongle, available on our web site.
For the X Series update — yes it is happening, but until it announces I am unable to comment further as to specs or even when that will happen.
January 8th, 2010 9:01 pm
Thank you for the clarification Matt. I’m relatively new to wanting to purchase something so close to it’s announcement. Lenovo has impressed me with how quickly it took a near perfect product (T400s) and turned it into a must-have product.
Congratulations to you and Lenovo for all that you’ve done and are continuing to do.
January 9th, 2010 8:37 pm
Many people here are asking about audio through DisplayPort but that question has not received any responses. I didn’t purchase a T400s because there was no HDMI, so I patiently waited for the T410s, hoping it would be HDMI capable. Now the T410s is out and still no HDMI.
Matt, if I purchase a DisplayPort to HDMI adapter, will it output audio as well as video? Thanks.
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January 9th, 2010 8:37 pm
Many people here are asking about audio through DisplayPort but that question has not received any responses. I didn’t purchase a T400s because there was no HDMI, so I patiently waited for the T410s, hoping it would be HDMI capable. Now the T410s is out and still no HDMI.
Matt, if I purchase a DisplayPort to HDMI adapter, will it output audio as well as video? Thanks.
January 10th, 2010 3:40 pm
Matt:
The question just above, of using this laptop to connect to HDTV has been asked and left unanswered several times. I think Levono plain messed up.
The cost of HDMI after a 10K site license is FOUR cents per use.
While the interest of the average “T” series user may be very low (?) the interest of a subset, those choosing to pay for a non-Intel GPU,is probably an order of magnitude higher.
The wikipedia article on displayport specifically mentions its audio ability.
Anyway this really is making me rethink buying switchable graphics.
Really a comment would be appreciated.
January 10th, 2010 4:24 pm
Kanex makes cables in Apple mini for DP + sound >Hdmi.
But so far no full>mini DP adapter.
With Apple getting approval for the mini from VESA I would bet that the full DP will be a relic by this time next year and the T411s will have a mini DP
January 10th, 2010 5:49 pm
It is very disappointing to see such ambiguity regarding capabilities/specs on T410 and T510 Laptops. The lack of coherence regarding laptop capabilities is harmful to the company reputation; the ‘trust factor’ is quickly being broken.
Webmaster needs to work on fixing listed info ASAP…not even the ‘Help me Decide’ links pull up relevant info. Same goes for Support Line – why would I buy a new Thinkpad when sales support can’t even tell me with confidence the specs on a laptop.
As much as I have praised Thinkpads to friends and coworkers in past, I can’t help but tell people to avoid them until website/support/specs etc are in sync.
January 10th, 2010 7:06 pm
Matt: Sorry to be dense about this, but two questions – and one is a repeat.
a) Blu-Ray. According to the Lenovo website, a Blu-Ray burner is an option on “select models” of the T400, T500, T410, T510. Which models? I can’t find it as an option. This is beyond a typo, because it has said this about T400/500 for months and when I have called, I was told “no models.” But now it says this specifically for T410/T510. It says “Blu-Ray Recordable High-Definition Optical Drive”… Which models?
http://shop.lenovo.com/SEUILib.....e#tabstart
b) Would it be too much to ask for Lenovo to be more clear on the website? What is a “Multi Recorder Optical Drive”?? If I click “Help Me Decide,” I get more information on Blu-Ray Recordable drives… but nothing that clearly explains what a “Multi Recorder Optical Drive” is… (See T510 on lenovo.com)
c) Help me evaluate what the real screen size difference is between T410 and T510? I’m really having a hard time deciding which model to go for and obviously there is no price difference between the two… so is it possible to see a comparison in screen size? I’m coming from a 15″ T61 and I don’t want to lose much screen real estate, if any, but not sure if I’d prefer a 16:10 or 16:9 panel – and this is mostly for doing work, not watching movies.
January 11th, 2010 4:31 am
Matt Kohut:
In some previous post you said that the only models with roll cage in display cover are T410s and T510 (not T410). But in the newest Personal systems reference document I found the presence of “next generation Thinkpad roll cage (in display cover)” ONLY in T410s.
So where is the truth? Can you corfirm or confute this information please?
Thanks for the answer.
Here is the link to PSRef : http://www.lenovo.com/psref/pdf/tabook.pdf
January 11th, 2010 11:27 am
Matt, can you provide some insights on the mysterious Nvidia NVS 3100M GPU? Is it better/faster or about the same as the previous ATI 3650?
January 11th, 2010 6:23 pm
I have received some helpful, if unwelcome, information from a representative at Lenovo regarding the strange video card in the W510. I still don’t know what it is, but it’s NOT the Quadro FX 880m. They don’t expect to have the 880m available until March, so they’re shipping the machine with the NVS 5100, whatever that is.
As for the warranty: if you call them instead of ordering online, you can get longer warranties. The website hasn’t caught up to what’s available.
As for the SSD options: You can buy the Samsung 256GB drive from Lenovo, but due to supply limits and red tape, you can’t buy a W510 with one installed. The best option at the moment, if you really want one, seems to be to order the SSD separately and buy the laptop with the smallest drive available. Then you make your recovery disks, swap drives, and reinstall. You can always put the HDD in an enclosure as a backup.
Hope this clears some things up.
David
January 11th, 2010 6:43 pm
Warranty: does anybody know if the T410 or T410s is available with an international warranty?
I’ve just gone through a debacle of having to send my T61p back to the US from Germany (at my own cost…TWICE) for warranty repair. The supposed worldwide service that I bought was not worldwide, but US-only.
The US ThinkPads seem to have some of the best options, but I need on-site service in Germany and the US at the very least.
January 11th, 2010 10:06 pm
Matt:
Can you please confirm the status of switchable graphics on the T410 and your overall statement that only T410s has it?
lenovo.com gives every indication that the T410 also has switchable graphics in multiple places on their site, and is conflicting with what are you are claiming.
January 12th, 2010 12:21 am
Lenovo sales on the phone says that Blu-Ray recordable will be an option soon on either T410 or T510 or both, and that more model options will be available either by month end or early February – that it is just an “inventory issue.”
Matt – any insight? confirmation? rejection?
Would be nice if everyone were on same page.
January 12th, 2010 3:37 am
Matt has left the building.
January 12th, 2010 8:53 am
I’m still here — I’ve just had no time this week to devote to the blog. I have to catch up from last week while I was at CES. I’ll be back before too long to start answering questions again.
I’ve avoided the audio over DP issue so far because the answer is “I don’t know.”
January 12th, 2010 9:24 am
Now that you’re back, I have another question: Why can the T510 can be ordered with both 1066 or 1333 MHz RAM? If the memory controller only supports 1066 MHz RAM on the Core i5 and Core i7, wouldn’t it be better to get memory with lower latency anyway?
January 12th, 2010 11:08 am
RE:#121 answer on audio for DP
Thank you
After learning more then I wanted to about DP and the experience of Apple users, an adapter like the one Kanex makes for a mini-DP port will be needed
January 12th, 2010 4:02 pm
Lots of excitement was created when Win7 was released due to Lenovo’s Enhanced Experience. A big component was support for Extensible Firmware Interface. Will this ever be coming for Arrandale or Montevina systems?
January 12th, 2010 4:03 pm
I did some more research on DP and it is obvious now that it is technically superior to HDMI. I can understand why it was chosen from an engineering standpoint. From a usability standpoint, the best interface in the world won’t do you any good if there is nothing to connect it to. Hopefully audio will work with an adapter. I want to order my new machine ASAP, so please get back to us Matt.
Here is an in-depth article on HDMI and DisplayPort for anybody interested:
http://www.edn.com/article/CA6594089.html
January 12th, 2010 7:25 pm
If you look at the Lenovo Access Help documentation it claims the DP passes both audio and video. I’m not sure if this is accurate.
Also the same docs state the T410s does not support FDE hardware-based encrypted HDDs…
January 12th, 2010 7:58 pm
I was just kidding, Matt. You’re doing a fantastic job answering all our questions. Thank you again for all your help!
January 12th, 2010 10:52 pm
Thanks David. You might want to call NVIDIA to let them know since they still have a W510 on their Quadro 880M page.
As a side-note – it looks like one can’t buy a W510 with fast dual core CPU to go with the faster video card – it has to be a slow quad core. This is unfortunate as a fast dual core W510 with fast graphics would have been a good alternative to the T510 which no longer has a “performance” GPU.
I don’t know what the cause of the repeat blunders is w.r.t. documentation/communications of specs/parts, but it seems an ongoing problem at Lenovo and the causes should be investigated – it really doesn’t do your design teams and engineers justice.
January 13th, 2010 4:45 am
Matt:
Could you please clarify the GPU used in the W510. There seems to be a bit of confusion going around about it.
The Lenovo reference manual lists the GPU available as Quadro FX 880m, however all ordering pages have the GPU as NVS 5100m, while front page description says “up to FX880m” (does this imply there is a “lower” option?). The reference manual has no mention of the NVS 5100m GPU anywhere.
At the same time on the HP web page the spec sheets for their new line indicate that FX880m and NVS 5100m are two different GPUs being offered on two different lines. FX880m being offered on “Power+portability” line and FX880m on “workstation” line. This makes me think that these two GPUs are completely different units.
Would really appreciate it if you could clear up the confusion regarding the GPUs being offered on this new model. Is it a typo? Will there be two different GPU options?
I am very interested in purchasing the W510, however before ordering the new machine it would be nice to know what exactly I will be getting.
January 13th, 2010 12:05 pm
Matt:
thanks for the good work you’ve been doing answering our questions. Your feedback is greatly appreciated. From one of your previous replies, you mentioned that it is best to wait until more options for the new line up are available and rightly so. However, with regard to the T410s, I managed to have a look at the link that sirius1983 posted( http://www.lenovo.com/psref/pdf/tabook.pdf). In it, none of the versions of the T410s
have the option of either discrete or switchable graphics. They all possess integrated graphics. Is the switchable graphics option further in the future or is this reference only provisional?
January 13th, 2010 1:24 pm
Matt:
Do you think the ATI cards might be back in the future for ThinkPads? If not this generation, maybe the next?
For me at least a certain amount of graphical performance is required, and I was very happy when the T500 got the ATI 3650 graphics (and I write this from said T500). I am also generally more satisfied with ATI products than nVidias.
Reading all the speculations about this NVS 3100 seems to indicate that graphics performance is downgraded on the T510, which is really bad news. Could you comment on the performance of this card?
Some notebook manufacturers offer the same model with _either_ ATI or nVidia graphics, the customer being able to choose which one to get. Would that be an impossible scenario for ThinkPads? It would make ThinkPads appeal to fans of both graphics cards. One comment mentions that ATI has better Linux support, which could be a factor for some businesses.
January 13th, 2010 7:51 pm
Matt
It seems more and more evident that Levono felt it had to offer stuff for Las Vegas show, and that most is not really ready. Even the date of late Feb seems unrealistic based upon the number of different things mentioned just on this site. Customer loyalty goes just so far in the US today And I think that few things enrage tech customers as much as vaporware
January 13th, 2010 9:58 pm
How come T410s is remove from the Lenovo website?
January 14th, 2010 8:12 am
Dose anybody know what is happening with T510 series ?? I’ve waited very long for the premiere and first the shipment time was estimated as more than 4 weeks and now the whole T510 series is gone from Lenovo site. Dose anybody know when they are going to be available for customers and what the shipment time will be?
January 14th, 2010 12:28 pm
People, It’s not Lenovo’s fault. Other vendors are having the same problems with their newly announced systems. I understand the frustration because I’ve also been waiting patiently for the new T510. Luckily my old trusty T60 is still working reliably.
January 16th, 2010 11:48 am
Hi
please ANYBODY!!! I want to know the ultimate truth about NVS 5100M?!!!!
what it compares to ?
I have ordered my W510 with a thought I’m getting the FX880 not some onboard intel GMA500 replacement!!! lenovo is missleading its loyal customers
with this horrible disinforation!
sorry forso many exclamation marks I JUST WANT TO BE SURE
January 18th, 2010 7:30 am
W510 with NVS 5100m that has been ordered on 12th was refunded on 17th …
why: no answer
when it will be available: no answer
why my money were held for 5 days: no answer
is lenovo nuts?: answer is yes it is!
am I upset? : very!
;(
January 19th, 2010 1:11 am
Johnny Dep, hopefully by the “no answer” you don’t mean your question here on this blog? Because this is no official support channel of Lenovo. If you really need support with your orders, you should write or more preferably call them directly.
January 19th, 2010 8:07 am
just thought someone has the info on this. was more interested to know whats the NVS 5100m really but no1 seem to know, and now when they removed it from the site we know even less.
January 26th, 2010 3:20 pm
[...] EDGE and X100e CES – New ThinkPad Roundup New Decade. New [...]
February 11th, 2010 5:03 pm
Matt,
Could you clarify the RAM specs for T410s, please?
What is the max? Lenovo allows to configure upto 4Gb but I’ve seen on the web that T410s will take upto 8Gb but needs for this faster DDR3 1333 RAM.
February 22nd, 2010 3:33 am
My rep said Lenovo can’t yet obtain a lenovo fast boot optimized Win-7 64-bit OS from MS, so they are only shipping 32-bit. Unfortunately, this means they are conning you if they sell more than 3GB RAM, as 32-bit can not access more than that.
The OS upgrade will require a clean install on a wiped drive, so you may want to buy minimal RAM and a disposable HDD, and then rebuild your machine later with a SATA 3GB/s SSD (it wont go as fast as 6GB/s).
Also, AFAIK, max RAM kit is 4GBX2 SODIMM DDR3 PC3-8500 1066 RAM, which goes for about $400 at the moment on eBay, but IF the t410s will take a faster socket RAM, please let me know.
June 22nd, 2010 8:08 am
I have this ThinkPad. It’s great to use and i love this one. The best thing is that it’s screen rotate, that is a part i love most about it. This is the best for gamers because i am one of them. I like playing games.